Roller Lifters

[jim martin]

i'm sure like me there are a few out there that can understand the big advantages these will allow.
coming soon
http://www.schubeckracing.com/new2/images/...er/rollerxl.jpg

[Hoosier Daddy]

Very cool.....who's gonna get em first?

[Cameron]

Roller cams and lifters have been available for AC VW for twenty years. Without a doubt, roller would be the way to go. But, last time I checked, you would be looking at $400 for a cam, and $50 per lifter, and then you have to find a competent machinist to do the machine work required to modify the lifter bores. (US dollars) You can run some really radical ramps and lifts with roller set up, which means you need incredibly strong valve train. $$$! Because of the cost, there is not much demand. All the cam profiles I have seen are strictly for race use. Go through an older Gene Berg catalog to find out some of the lifts and durations.

[Hoosier Daddy]

Read here for more info http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.ph...=roller+lifters

[jim martin]

Roller cams and lifters have been available for AC VW for twenty years. Without a doubt, roller would be the way to go. But, last time I checked, you would be looking at $400 for a cam, and $50 per lifter, and then you have to find a competent machinist to do the machine work required to modify the lifter bores. (US dollars) You can run some really radical ramps and lifts with roller set up, which means you need incredibly strong valve train. $$$! Because of the cost, there is not much demand. All the cam profiles I have seen are strictly for race use. Go through an older Gene Berg catalog to find out some of the lifts and durations.

this is not a machine in product.this is a half the weight on a stock vw flat tappet lifter with the same o.d to allow it to slip in.i don't have a problem with the price of $480.00 U.S for a set .when you look at the price of hardwelding a cam/sending your lifters out to be slr treated and ground/or the cost of the composite lifter,the result is the same.i'm liking this meathod over the composite for the fact of lack of having to rebush the case [$300.00 U.S]plus a way better option of camshaft desigh/options.spring pressures should not need to be scarry high .just keep all the rest of your valve trains weight in check,hell drop to a 42 mm intake as well. as the quicker ramp and time held at peak lift will outweigh a 44 mm valve anyway on a flat tappet cam.
anyway good product and its great to see some companies pushing the performance vw window.
when the WOKS motor goes ,i'm sold

[Cameron]

So Jim!
Still thinking about installing a roller cam and lifters?
How do you keep the roller oriented the correct direction,
if you don't machine a groove in the lifter bore?
In the old days, roller motors also had gussets welded around the lifter bores, because the side loads are so severe that the lifter would push out sideways through the lifter bore. Something else to think about. That's with stock 19mm roller lifters.
Edit: I should have added, isn't the whole point of running a roller set-up to get the radical ramps and lifts of a roller cam? Otherwise, why do it?

[Bubba]

To Cameron and Jim,

The schubeck roller lifters appear to have the anti rotation alignment via two small hardened steel balls imbedded into the side of the roller.

 A corresponding groove must be machined into the side of the lifter bore so this can work.  I can't see this holding up in a mag or aluminum case with racing spring tensions and the like.  The steel balls would carve up the lifter bore in no time, causing the cam lobe to see all kinds of different roller loads.

  Can you say rapid failure?   Sure!!  I wouldn't even trust an  ASB bushed lifter bore to be much better.  I might be wrong, but I just can't see how this setup would have any kind of longevity.  

Now if you made a roller lifter with a flat side or two...

What do you think?

[Tom H.]

not many engines Really need a roller lifter.  A \"regular\" ceramic shubeck lifter is all I'll ever need.

[jim martin]

still thinkin and why do it, easy answer . cylinder pressure and rpm.now yes i agree that 99% of 'street engines may not benifit from this product .but if you are like me and love theory and desighn this is a big step forward for  a flat 4 motor.yes we will have to wait and see how this system [schubeck roller]holds up in a bushed mag case and a aluminum case, as well as how the cases hold up .time will soon tell as a few people are getting ready to run them.as well there is also 1 other type of roller lifter that will require no indexing as the roller is a composite ball [like a ball bearing] so the roller and the sleve can turn anyway they like in the lifter bore, very cool!!
-efficiency,less friction,5-10 %hp increase,individual cam desighn ,etc .i like the idea.there is certain things i want to accomplish with my car ,and a roller lifter would really fit the bill.but time will tell.

 

[Tom H.]

I'm going the other way, all lite wt. Valve Train. How about 100 grams less per valve thu out the VT? this is wih an 86c, which would be too small a cam for a roller set-up.

I like new tech, too. when you stepping up to efi???    

[jim martin]

I'm going the other way, all lite wt. Valve Train. How about 100 grams less per valve thu out the VT? this is wih an 86c, which would be too small a cam for a roller set-up.

I like new tech, too. when you stepping up to efi???  

tom don't tempt me . i'm waffling on EFI.its plumbed for futre use!
--i think what i will do is run carbs next year just because i feel a need/want to do so.plus i need to relax and stop tinkering for awhile.
and if i give it one more year ,there is a bunch of new adaptive fuel injetion controls coming out that will plug into my LM1.very cool.
and besides that my carbs will just be worth that much more.