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Offline Shane

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Carnage
« on: July 10, 2004, 09:43:44 PM »
Well, James and Shane came over to help remove the engine,

As we got closer you could see more and more carnage. I have not split the case , However there is not much to salvage, I am thinking new engine and I am also thinking 2332/Ida's turbo is out... :(
 I am done for the year, But I must say that it has been a very nice ride.....

That is what was  in the intakes

That is the only piece of piston we found.

Bent Valve

The other head and damage on it

How the Cylinder was on the car

No piston on the rod

Finally the 2 hole in the top of the case....

and that is it!!! :(  :(  :(  :(  :(

 
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Russ

Carnage
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2004, 10:47:19 PM »
Shane,
i feel for you this really sucks,mabey we could find you a nice 1600 to play around with ;)
i can't tear a motor apart and repair but if you ever need any help with the install or anything else give me a shout
take it easy
russ
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Billyisgr8

Carnage
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2004, 11:12:45 PM »
Ouch!!!!!!!!!!

How much boost were you running?  Are those the mahle/cima piston & cylinders?  

Kevin
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Offline 1969deluxebus

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« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2004, 01:34:56 AM »
so does this mean that no more turbo hulk for just this season,
sad day but there is always bigger and better
matt street
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Offline Shane

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« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2004, 07:45:27 AM »
Quote
Ouch!!!!!!!!!!

How much boost were you running?  Are those the mahle/cima piston & cylinders?  

Kevin
Running 15 pounds boost, Cima's
 
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Billyisgr8

Carnage
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2004, 09:00:48 AM »
does this mean your turbo cam and lifters are for sale if they are still ok?

Kevin
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Offline Needles

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« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2004, 09:21:27 AM »
Sorry to hear it, It was sure fun watching you burn up that track!! :(  :wub:  
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Offline Boost_Retard

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« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2004, 09:22:10 AM »
Man thats brutal!  i was told that you blew out a cylinder...but i never expected to see carnage like that!

At least that motor went out with a good bang!

But really, thats shitty man. if i can help ya at all let me know!

Cale
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Offline Geoff

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« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2004, 10:16:41 AM »
Yeah that looks bad BUT your not out yet, I'm sure we can get ya back on the road with a smaller motor for the end of the season. You gotta drive it to the GCVWS!
Call my cell Shane.
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Offline Scratchy

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« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2004, 11:41:17 AM »
Shane,

Maybe you should get one of these to replace the Hulk instead:



http://www.tgfab.com/Funny.htm

It would be cheaper to fix when it blows up  :blink:

Seriously though, as you already know, speed costs $$$ but speed + reliablility = $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
Looks like you needed an inter-cooler and 114 Octane with water injection. That detonation is deadly.

I'm sure we'll CYA back out there again in one form or another, even if's on a bar stool   :D  
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Offline OUTKAST

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« Reply #10 on: July 11, 2004, 12:07:32 PM »
:(  :(  :(  :(  :( Bad news guy ! sorry to hear that the cars down sounds like a great group of guys down there ready to help though .Keep us informed :mellow:
Later OUTKAST
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Offline slammedbus

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« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2004, 02:59:43 PM »
DUDE!!! Sorry to see the hulk down! I really like coming to school on Monday's to show other staff what a VW can really do. Hopefull it'll be on the track again soon.
 :(  
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Offline Hansk

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« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2004, 04:27:01 PM »
OUCH!!!! :(  :(  :(  :(  :(   Just got the news .  This is a shocker for sure!
Any ideas why ?  15 psi on race fuel would not be the cause.  You sure it was only 15 psi.  ?   You sure it was race fuel ?
Back in the day we ran 20-25 psi. to run  10's  @ 125mph

If this was my motor I would just have to know why.  Not good enough to just say \" it's just racing\"    Something happened to cause this and it is avoidable if you can find out what it was.



btw ,  how do you make a small fortune in racing?

















START WITH A BIG ONE!!!!! :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  
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Offline Shane

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« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2004, 05:48:39 PM »
THat is my only question.. is what would cause this.... There is no blame to place anywhere!! I want to stress that . However I would also like to know why and if so what can be done to prevent this again...

There are no parts for sale... I am going to hang onto everything because I may want to Turbo again!!

BTW you guys/Gals are the best. Truly is a great community and I am very honored to be part of it! :wub:

A hug for everyone
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Offline Geoff

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« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2004, 06:08:42 PM »
My guess is it was running lean.
The exhaust was very grey/white as were the heads. Running race fuel sometimes means bigger main jets but that is only a guess at this point.
 
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Billyisgr8

Carnage
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2004, 06:11:42 PM »
LEAN........... look at the valve color....If by any chance it is the same carb set up when Jim had it and nothing changed, it was lean then too, I remember telling him a few times to richen it up, but he seemed to think it was running rich allready.  Your tailpipe will  tell the tale.  Any shade of grey  soot is to lean you want a more charcoal black color.  Turbo's like it very rich.

Don't give up, this is a learning experiance.  I wasted a $6000.00 custom turbo motor when I was 17 in a bout 2 hours of run time from being too lean.  Been there done that, and I know next time, I would rather have it rich and foul spark plugs a couple of times till I got it right.

Of course who is to say your piston didn't fail at the wrist pin boss either.  My bet is it was lean though.

Kevin
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Offline Hansk

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« Reply #16 on: July 11, 2004, 06:17:26 PM »
I also don't place any blame. Hope I didn't come across like that .  Something unforeseeable has happened.
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Offline Shane

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« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2004, 06:25:37 PM »
Quote
I also don't place any blame. Hope I didn't come across like that .  Something unforeseeable has happened.
No NO hans I know you did not... I just want everyone to know that I am not pointing fingers as I was the guy running it down the Track @ 126MPH!!!! Just dont want anyone taking it the wrong way... ;)  
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Offline Shane

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« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2004, 06:31:56 PM »
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Offline silas

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Carnage
« Reply #19 on: July 11, 2004, 06:45:40 PM »
hey shane, sorry to hear about the motor.

good for you for taking it so well. you and that car were kicking some serious ass out there, and i imagine your 10.83 will be tough to beat so you dont have to worry about the bumpage on the top 10 list. (allthough darren k. and jim m. are gonna pull some killer times this year, i just know it).

i'm sure we'll see you back in the saddle in no time. speed is like crack. it's addictive.

good job and good luck with the new motor.
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Offline AlanU

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« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2004, 06:48:15 PM »
Sorry to hear the bad news Shane.  It appears you were running lean with that white exhaust valve.  The evil detonation could have compromised the strength of the stroker pin boss of the cima piston at some point in the lifetime of that piston. Regardless the fact is the piston did fail and the pin boss did let go. Maybe next time richen her up and use a colder spark plug.

As per converstation at A&W I think a piece of mind nextime would be to use weisco's or J&E.  True forged pistons that have been proven over the years to take brutal abuse. Even with high quality products like that are still not immune to 2 flame fronts aka detonation. Stronger piston boss areas that'll give you a good piece of mind.

killer times with that engine. I foresee you shi!! kicking everyone in the Sport compact class at mission soon.

Sorry to hear it man!!! Just get back on your feet again. I know your addicted to adranaline after that ride.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2004, 06:50:35 PM by AlanU »
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Offline Geoff

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« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2004, 08:48:13 PM »
Like I said above looks lean, There is no reason to run Weisco pistons as Cimas will take easy 25-30lbs of boost like hans said. For peace of mind maybe but.......
If it was a little richer this may not have happened, But if it went lean a weisco would let go as well. Fix the problem not bandaid it with another type of piston.

15lbs of boost is not much at all and most of the cars running down south use Cima's and 20+ lbs of boost.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2004, 08:49:20 PM by Gkafer »
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Offline James Buchan

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« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2004, 09:26:44 PM »
Why would it run lean though? Curious as last time it was due to 94 octane - I'd hate to run mine lean!
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Offline James Buchan

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« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2004, 09:32:30 PM »
Looks like it was a bad weekend for turbo motors - SHane wasn't the only one to blow
http://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=...4115&highlight=
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Offline jim martin

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« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2004, 11:05:22 PM »
here is  a couple of things ,
first in order to help aid a turbo car ,or any forced induction vehicle . TIMING AND TEMPATURE need control !!!with nitrous use there is a natural cooling effect !!!! but with a turbo or a kompressor as the air is compressed it also gets very hot,DETENATION! .  next time around.i would use a   -- j and s safeguard knock control with boost input to control timing and back it off when needed as well as either mix my fuel with 10-15 % alcohol or use a alcohol injection set -up to aid in cooling !!
as far as a lean out ,unless there was a new fuel problem due too lack of fuel or level or angle in the bowl  i don't think it was the problem,that leads too detenation caused by heat ,the colouring on the exhaust valves in my opinion are ok for the heat that was generated inside the combustion area.
also don't know if you still had the LM1 in the car as the data would tell the story.
sorry shane too hear the hulk has ground too a stop ,but the most important thing is that you are here too tell about it !!!!
« Last Edit: July 12, 2004, 07:52:03 AM by jim martin »
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Offline Hansk

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« Reply #25 on: July 11, 2004, 11:18:46 PM »
I am sooo totally amazed that car ran that hard with only 15lbs boost :blink:  
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Offline Island bugs

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« Reply #26 on: July 12, 2004, 12:01:18 AM »
Shane
 Just got home. Great to meet you. What a bummer. I truly feel for you and I sure do know how it feels. Let me know if there's anything I can do.
 Wayne
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Offline Shane

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« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2004, 06:46:32 AM »
NIce to meet you aswell Wayne, Sorry i did not come out .. Little bummed...
Side Note, I watched  the Video where I shot sparks.....paused it and Framed it on my Big screen, It was the sump touching the ground on the second hop.. So that is good news...  :blink:
 
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Offline Scratchy

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« Reply #28 on: July 12, 2004, 09:23:48 AM »
As for the cause, both passes I saw (heard), there was a very loud bang/pop at about 2/3rds - 3/4 track
coming from the exhaust (more like a gunshot). Under full load, this would indicate either detonation or
a lean out condition. Did you have an O2 sensor and gauge to verify the A/F setting under full load?
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Offline 66split

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« Reply #29 on: July 12, 2004, 12:42:50 PM »
wow, this is a bummer.  I have a high idle in my bus right now, which means more air, which means lean...i think I'll fix it before going out for drive.  rick
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