Thoughts On Engine Build

[saskatoonguy]

well after attending the great canadian and learning from trevor, and all you local guys, bruce, geoff, allan, and ridding in allan s acr i must have a bigger motor for my little cal-look 61 project , i want something that i can street drive , and take to alberta and bc on occasion , but still spank a vtec if i need to , i m been thiking of a 1914cc, with 043 heads demello crank , engle 120 , and kadrons for carbs, any thoughts or ideas? advice?

[Geoff]

Thats a nice combo and it will work well, I would go the route of some re worked 044 like the Outlaw heads we have.  This will make a big difference in the way the motor performs. Also look into 36-40mm webers, This will make even better but if on a budget run the Kdogs. The Kdogs have been great carbs for years and I have owned a few sets and had good results.

[saskatoonguy]

outlaw heads? not sure what those are , but , i like the k dogs cause i heard they have lots of low end grunt , and thats what i want ,    

[Black-Back]

bottom end power doesn't just come from the carbs; the cam, heads compression, exaust, all these things greatly affect the power just as much as the carbs do, however, by playing with venturi size you can adjust the rpm/power range mildly, ie. smaller vents more bottom end, and vice versa. 40mm Kdogs as Geoff put it are a 40mm carb, but come stock with a 28 mm vent (if I'm not mistaken) hense the low end grunt. but you limit the rpm range to probably 4500 or so(guessing)because they're only single throat. Use the kadrons for now, IMO 40mm Webers from Geoff would be a lot better for all around power.

Build it, drive it, have fun!

Mike

[James Buchan]

I've found with my 1914 the power is from 3600-7800rpm. I really have to wind it up to get things pumping. For a daily driver that really isn't an optimal solution. I would think a better route may be to build a mild stroker. Don't get me wrong a 1914 will spank a vtec or even a mustang but for low end stump pulling grunt you need a stroker crank.

Carbs are a big factor but heads are even more important. Best off the shelf heads out there for the street are 044's from CB - airpseed stocks many different configurations in them.  

[saskatoonguy]

I've found with my 1914 the power is from 3600-7800rpm. I really have to wind it up to get things pumping. For a daily driver that really isn't an optimal solution. I would think a better route may be to build a mild stroker. Don't get me wrong a 1914 will spank a vtec or even a mustang but for low end stump pulling grunt you need a stroker crank.

Carbs are a big factor but heads are even more important. Best off the shelf heads out there for the street are 044's from CB - airpseed stocks many different configurations in them.

well if not a 1914cc for a street car then what else? any ideas ?

[Black-Back]

78mm is the next size crank, but 82 is where the power's at, 82x94=2276cc, but you'll need at least 45 dells for that, you could run a 78mm, and 90.5(2007), or, 78x94=2165, 82x90.5-2110cc. the cranks will all cost about the same as well as the p/c's, so the real question is how much $ do you have for your carbs?
So many choices!!!!AAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!

pick one........build it.........drive it................Have fun!!!!!!!

Mike
 

[Bruce]

, i want something that i can street drive , and take to alberta and bc on occasion , but still spank a vtec if i need to , i m been thiking of a 1914cc, with 043 heads demello crank , engle 120 , and kadrons for carbs, any thoughts or ideas? advice?

That's called having your cake and eating it too.  Not many VWs around are capable of rice spanking, and long distance trips.

You need an engine that gets its power from reliable sources.  For example, Weber IDFs (or Dellorto DRLAs) will make more hp than Kadrons with no detriment on reliability.  By using Kads you are just throwing away reliable hp.  Bottom end torque does not suffer with IDFs or DRLAs.  The isolated runners ensure this.

Some say the rod angle of an 82 stroke/VW rod is too great for long term reliablity.  I don't know about this, but I can say a 78 stroke/VW rod is dead reliable.

90.5 P&Cs have been proven extremely reliable for high mileage.  There have been countless engines going over 100k miles without re-ringing.  The same can't be said for 94s.  However, don't think you will have to replace them at 5-10k miles either.  They last a lot longer than that.  I've only heard of one instant where a guy went 100k miles on a set of 94s without re-ringing.  If you are the type that doesn't mind a ring job at 30-50k miles, go for 94s.  However, if you are like me that means every 2-3 years, no thanks.

For heads, Darren K has developed an incredible flowing 40x35 head based on a VW 043 casting.  This is the one to get.  Airspeed sells this head.  The lighter valves means you can use lower spring pressure for a given rpm limit.  Lower spring pressures means less stress on the cam and lifters.  (I'm sure you've heard of cam and lifter problems recently)  Add Ti retainers and Aircooled.net aluminum pushrods.  These heads on a 2165 with 45 Dellortos, an Engle 120 cam, 9:1 CR should easily make 140-160hp.  And you could drive it 20 hrs straight.  Have 2 sets of rockers.  1.1:1s for reliable long distance cruising, and 1.25s for around town rice cooking.
 

[saskatoonguy]

well i am banking on spending arounf 3500 for engine and carbs, looking at used carbs mainly , never thought of  dells , but i will give it some reasearch!

[Black-Back]

That's called having your cake and eating it too. Not many VWs around are capable of rice spanking, and long distance trips.

You need an engine that gets its power from reliable sources. For example, Weber IDFs (or Dellorto DRLAs) will make more hp than Kadrons with no detriment on reliability. By using Kads you are just throwing away reliable hp. Bottom end torque does not suffer with IDFs or DRLAs. The isolated runners ensure this.

Some say the rod angle of an 82 stroke/VW rod is too great for long term reliablity. I don't know about this, but I can say a 78 stroke/VW rod is dead reliable.

90.5 P&Cs have been proven extremely reliable for high mileage. There have been countless engines going over 100k miles without re-ringing. The same can't be said for 94s. However, don't think you will have to replace them at 5-10k miles either. They last a lot longer than that. I've only heard of one instant where a guy went 100k miles on a set of 94s without re-ringing. If you are the type that doesn't mind a ring job at 30-50k miles, go for 94s. However, if you are like me that means every 2-3 years, no thanks.

For heads, Darren K has developed an incredible flowing 40x35 head based on a VW 043 casting. This is the one to get. Airspeed sells this head. The lighter valves means you can use lower spring pressure for a given rpm limit. Lower spring pressures means less stress on the cam and lifters. (I'm sure you've heard of cam and lifter problems recently) Add Ti retainers and Aircooled.net aluminum pushrods. These heads on a 2165 with 45 Dellortos, an Engle 120 cam, 9:1 CR should easily make 140-160hp. And you could drive it 20 hrs straight. Have 2 sets of rockers. 1.1:1s for reliable long distance cruising, and 1.25s for around town rice cooking.

Very well put Bruce, I think I learn something from you daily! On some other forums there is alot of debate about rod angle ratios, cams etc, when building huge engines, but alot of people forget that you can still manage to get great power out of a smaller crank as long as the components are matched up properly. No doubt you've seen Darrens car rippin' up the track, If I could afford it right now he'd be my #1 choice for my heads.
I hope your decision is made easier by Bruces almighty wisdom, he's certainly enlightened me on more than a few occasions!

Good Luck!!

Mike





 

[saskatoonguy]

thanks for all the info guys, !!!  well , now on to the tranny and clutch questions , stock tranny? will it hold on a 1914?

[Black-Back]

The power has to go somewhere before it hits the wheels. stock diffs don't like being abused too much(only two spider gears)you definately need to go with a super diff.
 I believe that the later model 3:88:1 R/P is the strongest but doesn't have the same get up and go that a 4:125:1 R/P has.
I think that if you're driving like a sane person, a stock tranny will last a while but if you're lighting them up, or shifting hard all the time you'll blow it sooner than later.
Bruce, any insite?

Mike

[Bruce]

Since you are on a budget, you can do some hunting.  What you are looking for is a late 73 swing axle trans.  External differences are the large 19mm cross shaft, and the late gear carrier.  To learn what the late gear carrier looks like, you need to find a SSC trans.  You need to find a swing axle trans with a SSC gear carrier, this is the shit.

At the front end of the pinion shaft there's a small roller bearing in the gear carrier.  The bearing in the SSC gear carrier is pressed in.  The early version bearing is held in place with a hex head set screw.  The hex is 11 mm and points straight up.  If you are looking at the underside of the gear carrier you will see this bolt head.  If you find a swing axle trans without this bolt head, get it.  It comes with all the goodies necessary to survive any engine.  You get the 9 tooth mainshaft, steel shift forks, and 15 tooth side gears.

Otherwise, get a late IRS DSC trans (71-73) and get a SSC and have Trevor perform a trans-meld.  You'll also need all the swing axle junk.  Make sure your sidecovers have o-rings.

[saskatoonguy]

wow! bruce do you know everything?  well i know i want to stay swing axle , so i ll start looking i guess ,