AirSpeed VW Community Forums
General Forums => Air Speed Lounge => Topic started by: bwaz on October 29, 2005, 09:40:06 PM
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Picked up the new project, a nice 68 beetle convert out of Lacey Washington, with the U-haul truck and trailer from down there. Got to the Sumas tonight, no problems on the US side, got to the Canuck side, got all the paperwork done, and then was told all done, except that YOU CAN'T DRIVE THAT RENTAL TRUCK IN CANADA! What? The customs officer said that because it was like importing a vehicle, I would have to go back to the states and get a vehicle with Canadian plates and do it again because I was not american driving a US car? ARGHHH. Fought, argued, called U-Haul who didn't have a clue.... and was hooped. I'd have to leave the truck, trailer and car on the US side and come back with another truck. Went to the cash to pay my GST and asked the guy there, explained again.... he said what? Called the rookie over and said that in most cases his interpretaion was true, but not on rentals. Sorry about that. After an hour trying to come up with solutions, getting someone from the US to drive the US vehicle in canada was the only option.... Sorry, you can go now. At least I hope someone else trying to do this with the rookie won't have to go through the experience that I did! By the way, I didn't think there were any duties on older vehicles, the rookie charged me a 6% duty? Is that right.... VWBOOP?
home safe anyway... on to the work of getting the car back on the road!
Brian
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AKAIK it depends on the age of the vehicle and where it came from.
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Yes Other than a rental evidently it is illegal for a Canadian to drive an American car in Canada. I think it's a $200 fine or something. Wayne
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damn, what a hassle. glad it worked out in the end.
i had similar problems trying to get insurance for the 64 so i could drive it back. icbc would insure me but would not give me plates or a paper permit. i would have to go get a paper permit in the states. except the insurance company i called in seattle told me they couldnt give me a paper permit for some reason. i ended up calling 3 autoplan agents up here and 2-3 down there and was getting nowhere so i ended up using my bosses dealer plate. that worked.
6% duty sounds about right. i'm pretty sure that's what i had to pay too.
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You guys got screwed by ignorant customs officers. There is no duty on antique autos. Anything older than 25 years is considered an antique auto. Apply for a refund, you will get it back.
Wayne, it is not illegal for a Canadian to drive a US registered car in Canada. Canada Customs doesn't like it when a Canadian drives a US registered car into Canada, but in reality than can't do squat since it is not illegal. For example, my brother is a Canadian citizen, and only a CDN. He lives in LA and has a US registered car that he drives into Canada all the time. He does not own any cars registered here.
The laws of Canada apply equally to all CDN citizens. DUHHHH!
Since my brother is allowed to drive a US car here, so can I. What customs doesn't like is the possibility that a CDN could go down to the US and buy a car then say they are just borrowing it from a US friend for a short time and driving it in Canada. They think you are trying to illegally import it.
As far as the rental goes, since it is legal for a US citizen to drive a US rental car in Canada, it is also legal for a Canadian citizen to drive that same US rental in Canada. The BC motor vehicle act applies to all drivers regardless of citizenship.
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when we brought the oval home.
my wife drove the thing from California.we did the US customs part.
then drove over to the Canadian side,the girl asked if my wifes plans(figured she was an american) my wife said i just bought this car.they told her to pull inside and pay the tax.mind you this was three years ago mabey something has changed?
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I looked on their website, and it says no duty on cars of Canadian or US origin, however, I think there is exemption on vintage cars as well. We brought some parts across last week and we were charged no duty...still not used to getting charged pst & GST (hogwash). It is definately worth investigating further. Many times I think it comes down to who you get going across, as some of the members on here mentioned they've recently brought cars across and were not made to wait the three days? Congratulations on your new convertible! Love to see some pics. B)
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I did not pay any duty on the 67 I imported a few weeks ago. Just PST/GST. No way around that.
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I paid duty on mine that is a 56 2 weeks ago
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I did not pay any duty on the 67 I imported a few weeks ago. Just PST/GST. No way around that.
They shouldn't have charged you PST as they charge you that when you go to register your car. Their website reflects this. Keep your reciept.
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I asked about the vintage car thing when I brought back the DC and it is true when it is manufactured in the US or
Canada, but the VW isn't so that is why you have to pay duty & pay your GST at the border and you pay your PST when you register in Canada. Check your papers Lanny one of those was probably duty and not PST.
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Bruce
Just because your brother has not been stopped does not mean that is the law or perhaps he meets residency requirements of the law. In other words we are not all \"equal\" DUH !!!
Found these quotes on a quick internet search:
\"Canada would not allow him into Canada with his U.S. registered car because he did not have a valid U.S. visa (As you will find out in more detail later on in this book, if you do not have a valid visa to live in the States, you cannot drive a U.S. registered car in Canada).\"
rental cars-
\"Driving a rental car across the US-Canadian border is usually not a problem, so long as you have made this arrangement with the car rental company. Make sure you have a copy of the rental agreement with you, and that is states you have permission to take the vehicle across the border.\"
\"N.B. Canadian law restricts a Canadian citizen from driving a US registered hire vehicle into Canada and then returning it back to the US. The same law applies for American citizens. An American cannot rent a car in Canada, drive it to the USA and then return it to Canada. This law is applied by the insurance companies.\"
Unlike you I am willing to admit that it is possible that all of these people and myself MIGHT be wrong but I suggest you verify before you state things as \" facts\" It is possible that this is an old law that has been changed but I know I have read (with disbelief!) that a canadian man in Vancouver had been fined for driving his relatives american registered vehicle.
Let's here from the lawyers & police officers out there?
wayne
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just pulled out our customs reciept
we paid GST only no duty but did have to PST when we registered the car.
this was 3 years ago
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I paid duty on mine that is a 56 2 weeks ago
Check your papers. If you got charged duty it is wrong. ALL cars that are 25 years old or older are duty free, regardless of where they are manufactured.
The same goes for any auto part that is made for a 25 year old car or older.
Apply for a refund, you will get it back.
Customs refund form (http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pbg/cf/b2g/b2g-05b.pdf)
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I paid $323.00 in Duty.I just checked.
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I paid $323.00 in Duty.I just checked.
I bet you've already printed out that form!
In section 6c, it will help your refund claim go smoother if you can provide the proper HS code for an antique auto. Since Lanny didn't get charged duty, his forms will show the right code. Lanny?
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Once we get all the facts sorted out we should make a sticky on this topic as a lot of us bring cars up from the states (due to condition re: all the road salt used here, not used even in WA results in clean rust free cars sometimes just across the border).
If we could get this straightened out with some import codes or ?? then we could print off a thread and when we do go across we would be able to let customs know where to look for the info. It's really BS that people encounter different treatment depending on who they get at the border, and it's BS that some are made to pay duty if they don't have to ]:( .
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It appears that having the right HS code number doesn't guarantee the proper duty rate. I just dug up a couple of import forms I have for antique auto parts. Both have the HS code number 8708.10.29.90, but one had duty charged incorrectly to it. Many times in the past I have verbally confirmed to the officer that there's no duty. More than once the guy had to re-do it.
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As the 67 I imported is not a complete car, it was imported as a 'Vehicle imported and dismantled for parts'. Form 3 ,blah, blah, blah. This means the VIN cannot be used to register the car. I did not pay any duty. This is the first time I really looked at the paperwork and noticed an $86 'declaration' charge on my Visa. Sneaky buggers.
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So I went to the border today and tryed to figure out why I payed duty! They said that it does not matter whether it is vintage or not because it is an import.I said I knew people that recently brought some old vw through and they did not pay any duty.So why am I? I told them I wanted to see it in writing.No response.They handed me the form and said fill this out.So now I have to send this form away with an explanation as to why I shouldn't pay duty.So people what is my explanation? That it is a vintage import?
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Once we get all the facts sorted out we should make a sticky on this topic.
exactly what i was thinking. great idea. B)
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For those interested here are two web references on importing motor vehicles.
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pub/cp/rc4140...0/rc4140-e.html (http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pub/cp/rc4140/rc4140-e.html)
http://www.riv.ca/english/html/how_to_impo...ort.html#before (http://www.riv.ca/english/html/how_to_import.html#before)
The latter reference seems very user friendly. Neither actually mention Duty free importation of Vintage vehicles, other than vehicles manufactured in the USA or Canada. I will call on Monday to get the skinny.
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I'll be watching for an update!
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damn, what a hassle. glad it worked out in the end.
i had similar problems trying to get insurance for the 64 so i could drive it back. icbc would insure me but would not give me plates or a paper permit. i would have to go get a paper permit in the states. except the insurance company i called in seattle told me they couldnt give me a paper permit for some reason. i ended up calling 3 autoplan agents up here and 2-3 down there and was getting nowhere so i ended up using my bosses dealer plate. that worked.
6% duty sounds about right. i'm pretty sure that's what i had to pay too.
Down here..... in the states you have to get a trip permit (paper plate) I believe would be the same thing, from the state patrol. You would have to get the sale papers then go down to the nearest state patrol office and request a trip permit to transport the car. The only thing I'm not sure of is if you can use this permit to take a car out of the country.
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through my quick search online the only info it says about importing vehicles and duty is this
\"Import duties
If your vehicle is eligible for importation into Canada according to both customs and Transport Canada requirements, you will have to pay import assessments which may include duty, excise tax, and the 7% goods and services tax (GST). Provincial sales tax may apply when you license your vehicle.
Generally, you do not have to pay duty on an imported vehicle that was manufactured in the United States or Canada however, we will assess duty on a vehicle manufactured in a country other than the United States.
The value for duty is calculated in Canadian funds and is generally based on the price paid for the imported new or used vehicle purchased in a sale of that imported vehicle.\"
Note it does not say anything about an exemption for the older than 15 year vehicles.
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pub/cp/rc4140...0/rc4140-e.html (http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pub/cp/rc4140/rc4140-e.html)
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So I guess tell them it was made in Canada :lol:
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Here's the new project that started all the fuss!
Brian
(https://airspeedparts.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg311.imageshack.us%2Fimg311%2F2695%2Ftrailer1gg.th.jpg&hash=4ab3db637d352553a9b1ebcd7db4340e3abf6e65) (http://img311.imageshack.us/my.php?image=trailer1gg.jpg)
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Pics not working. Try this :
[IMG]http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=levon21dn.jpg
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Damn Man! You could have looked at the one I am selling.Still FS $7400
(https://airspeedparts.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg337.imageshack.us%2Fimg337%2F2954%2Fimg11902ax.jpg&hash=a8a14538d5c046ae70bb00804e0fc24ab126bb73) (http://imageshack.us)
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Thanks for the offer... it was out of my price range! I managed to get mine for $3000 canuck bucks. Needs a bit of work, some convert rubber stuff... and I'll have to have a deeper look as to whether it gets dismantled big time and cleaned up, or if just a once over could do. Have to think about it! Any more border news Boop?
Brian
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Steiner, any update on your application for a duty refund?
I was over at Alp's place a couple of days ago and asked him to dig up his papers for the 3 old import cars he has imported in recent years. His 1970 Datsun Roadster and his 1965 VW Type 2 single cab both came in with NO DUTY. The HS code on both of these car's import forms was 8703.90.00.90.
Then his 1974 BMW 2002 was erroneously charged duty. The classification # it got was HS 8703.23.00.51.
All you guys that got charged duty, check your form. I bet they have the latter number above instead of the former. Apply for a refund on this form here:
Duty refund form (http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pbg/cf/b2g/b2g-05b.pdf)
This duty free status is bestowed upon every car 25 years old or older, regardless of where it was made.
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I asked about the vintage car thing when I brought back the DC and it is true when it is manufactured in the US or
Canada, but the VW isn't so that is why you have to pay duty & pay your GST at the border and you pay your PST when you register in Canada. Check your papers Lanny one of those was probably duty and not PST.
not only vintage but any car made in canada or USA is duty free, the age of it does not matter.
ill have to check if i paid duty on my 1960. i dont even know.
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I just spoke to a lady at Canada Customs. After 25 years there is no applicable duty regardless of where a car was made. THE FINAL WORD! ;)
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Thanks for reminding me. I have been so busy lately that I forgot to send off the forms. I paid over $ 300 in duty. I'm going to get on that tonight!
Thanx Bruce!
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OK, so I'm just looking for a little clarity here: I can drive down to Washington state, buy a vintage VW, rent a uhaul trailer, and bring the vehicle back to Canada. All I need for the border is the vehicle title and a bill of sale? I know the US side needs to see the afformentioned paperwork 72 hours in advance, but is ther anything else I am missing? What about driving a vehicle back? I know the border procedure would be the same, but I've searched high and low and can't find any info on whether it is possible for a Canadian to get a temp. permit on a US vehicle and drive it back. We've all heard of someone doing it, etc, but does anybody actually have FIRSTHAND EXPIRIENCE? I'm considering the possibility of importing a vehicle, and I just want it to be as painless as possible.
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OK, so I'm just looking for a little clarity here: I can drive down to Washington state, buy a vintage VW, rent a uhaul trailer, and bring the vehicle back to Canada. All I need for the border is the vehicle title and a bill of sale? I know the US side needs to see the afformentioned paperwork 72 hours in advance, but is ther anything else I am missing? What about driving a vehicle back? I know the border procedure would be the same, but I've searched high and low and can't find any info on whether it is possible for a Canadian to get a temp. permit on a US vehicle and drive it back. We've all heard of someone doing it, etc, but does anybody actually have FIRSTHAND EXPIRIENCE? I'm considering the possibility of importing a vehicle, and I just want it to be as painless as possible.
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To get a temp permit in WA, you get it from the US DOT. aka the weigh scales.
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I got my refund for teh DC
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Pacifico or Corona, Shane.
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When I talked to ICBC, they wanted to sell me a permit to drive the vehicle once I was the owner. I would put a temp on it, and drive it back to canada. (I ended up on the u-haul in the end)
Brian
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I got my refund!
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bump
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i think border people go out of their way to be annoying to people impoting cars.
when we import our 67 cougar he border officer didnt belive that we paid what we declared for it (paid 5k american, which ill admit was a smoking deal) so he got the number of the lady we bough it off of, called her and pretended to be a buyer to confirm how much we paid for it. and all the while my dad has the bank reciet for the cashiers check for 5000 american in his hand and the guy still wouldnt belive us, added n extra hour to our trip
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Have the rules changed? When we brought back our bus a few weeks back Leanne was charged duty. I just went this morning again to the truck border and spoke witha a cocky border agent and said that all cars that are not made in north america are subjest to duty which I believe he is wrong. But he also stated that it has always been that way. I am always down to prove somebody like that wrong but without knowing what to quote (aside from that the car is 25 years or older) I came home with my tail between my legs. All of the links from other posts do not work sooooooooooooo,
Can somebody post a link to "the form" and or the rule so I can get my refund and inform the border .
Thx,
Richard
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nothing has changes he is WRONG! Now go back and get a senior officer to teach the cocky shithead something he should know.
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nothing has changes he is WRONG! Now go back and get a senior officer to teach the cocky shithead something he should know.
Thanks but does anybody have this in writing. I know that we are right but I need the proof plus I still need the form or form #.
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Steiner, any update on your application for a duty refund?
I was over at Alp's place a couple of days ago and asked him to dig up his papers for the 3 old import cars he has imported in recent years. His 1970 Datsun Roadster and his 1965 VW Type 2 single cab both came in with NO DUTY. The HS code on both of these car's import forms was 8703.90.00.90.
Then his 1974 BMW 2002 was erroneously charged duty. The classification # it got was HS 8703.23.00.51.
All you guys that got charged duty, check your form. I bet they have the latter number above instead of the former. Apply for a refund on this form here:
Duty refund form (http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/E/pbg/cf/b2g/b2g-05b.pdf)
This duty free status is bestowed upon every car 25 years old or older, regardless of where it was made
Bruce
My customs form has the classification #8703.90.00.90 and I still paid duty at 6.1%. Any comment?
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But he also stated that it has always been that way.
He's partly right. The rules have not changed. Although my memory only goes back to the 70s, even then, 25 year old cars and parts were duty free, regardless of origin. Him babbling about made in North America suggests something to do with NAFTA, but NAFTA has nothing to do with the existing rule.
The duty free status is not attached to the HS code # like I thought. Both parts for, and whole cars 25 yo and older are duty free. I noticed on some of my import papers for parts that sometimes they would try to charge duty, and sometimes no, even with the exact same HS code #. There's one guy that I kept seeing at the Pt Roberts crossing that knew his shit, and he had trouble determining the exact method to ensure duty free. I haven't seen him for a long time, so I've been unable to follow up. Most of the other thieves at the Pt Roberts crossing seem to be short of experience.
For now, be adamant that there's no duty on ANY car made ANYWHERE in the world as long as it's 25 yo or older. Same goes for parts for a 25 yo car or older. If the cockey bastard won't capitulate, ask to speak to the superintendent. If the superintendent isn't around, just talk to another guy. There's usually someone there that knows the rule.
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My friend the border guard (does not everybody have one), has told me that the only exception to the US rental vehicle thing is U-Haul, because every vehicle they own is registered in the US
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Some people are asking for direct experience of someone who went to washington and drove a Us car back here to Canada.
Thats Me
Firstly i went to the Auto plan agent at broadway and Burrard and spoke to a lady there who has much experience of this(cant remember her name blond lady who recently 3yrs ago had a wee baby if that helps) i say this because others in the office were unsure.She was very knowledgable though.
I explained to her that i wanted to go get my split panel van and drive it back.
She issued me with a window/paper permit that was valid for 14 days, the only stipulation was that i had to drive it from where i bought it in US to Canada and then to the testing station to get it checked out, which i did , i took it to German Autohaus and they did some work and got it checked by the testing station for me. (So i guess this means no road trips before you bring it back) I still had the Us plates on it which hadexpired but i took them off and put them under the seat, so i had only the window permit while both in the states and here in Vancouver . I took it to the border at sumas, only because i had to cross at the weekend due to work. I had a sent them the docs 72hrs before, and had original title and registrations with me, also a bill of sale ;). I was asked if i had a copy of the for sale AD which i didnt i told them i bought from a friend. they were satisfied and looked the vehicle over, i showed them where the vin number was and they checked against the paperwork, shook my hand and i was off down the free way at 40mph.
;D Cant remember if i paid duty etc , ill see if i can still find the paper work and post up if i do. This post is mainly to do with getting a paper permit to drive in the states and Canada. Hope it helps
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For those that got a refund on the duty they paid, how long did it take to get it back? I sent my form off only last week but I'm just curious.
Shane
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For those that got a refund on the duty they paid, how long did it take to get it back? I sent my form off only last week but I'm just curious.
Shane
What form or fom # did you use? Is there a special heading that you have to put on this form?