AirSpeed VW Community Forums
General Forums => Air Speed Lounge => Topic started by: Lanny on August 16, 2004, 09:31:14 PM
-
Great weekend..Nice dinner after the show Sunday, cruising home..BANG! The Berg 5 is now a special 2 piece model..The diff exploded at 65 MPH on the highway,breaking the tranny in half, no warning. Hopefully Cameron can post the photos he shot last night while waiting for the tow truck..It's ghastly..Oh well, I counted 48 passes on that diff. :D
-
CHa-CHing wow that really sucks! Get your checkbook out!
-
now you got me worried,but at least i now know to stop at 47.
sorry too hear this lanny,hopefully its reparable,fingers crossed
-
I'll pull it apart very soon. This type of thing will keep me awake at night, especially with 6 weeks of summer driving left. I suspect a new diff, R/P,case and possibly a mainshaft..argh. Luckily, I have a fresh 5 spd 'O' type R/P and an extra 5 mainshaft in my toolbox. Wish me luck.
-
Sorry to hear that lanny.
thats 48 HARD passes on that tranny, along with LOTS of street driving.
that is awesome for any tranny.
Stephan
PS: Cameron..post up some pics!
-
Dam.......48 passes, and how many years?? lets hope the next one lasts as long!!
Mike
-
I'll pull it apart very soon. This type of thing will keep me awake at night, especially with 6 weeks of summer driving left. I suspect a new diff, R/P,case and possibly a mainshaft..argh. Luckily, I have a fresh 5 spd 'O' type R/P and an extra 5 mainshaft in my toolbox. Wish me luck.
Pull up a seat beside me on the bench brotha... We can cruise in da Ford!!!
-
Gavin and I were going home from the GCVWShow, when we saw Lanny at the side of the highway. Gavin was driving, and pulled over almost immediately. We backed down the highway and stopped just in front of Lanny's car. The beetle had a big stream of gear oil running out from underneath.
I stuck my camera under the car, and took some really good photos of Lanny's exploded gear box, right there at the side of the road. I tried to post the pics on Sunday night, but Samba is not letting me on right now. Stay tuned, photos will be posted eventually.
-
As sad as it is, I can't wait to see them!!!
Mike
-
wonder if its the \"pin falling out syndrone\", and we were just talking aboot that, Cameron.
well, ya got your pass that beat Geoff............
dang, Lanny, I coulda loaned ya my 5 but its in pieces now too, R&P time.
-
\"Hi\" My name is Lanny and I just blowed up my tranny real good like!
(https://airspeedparts.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thesamba.com%2Fvw%2Fgallery%2Fpix%2F168851.jpg&hash=6785b186f3fb5d411d778e6e15b6b1f003e4a86f)
(https://airspeedparts.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thesamba.com%2Fvw%2Fgallery%2Fpix%2F168850.jpg&hash=5985edd4fda834a1aa45c023abf17887b5bde3ad)
-
[\"well, ya got your pass that beat Geoff............\"]
Ummmm, was that some sort of goal to beat me on friday????? News to me?
Still a ways away from my 12.22 and i'm a long way away from getting close to Allans 11.95. Maybe next year i'll catch up to Allan but by then he'll probably be a 11.70. When will it all end?!?!?!? :D
-
\"takin a dump\".
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_pag...hp?pic_id=84379 (http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=84379)
sorry to here about the casualty, lanny. best of luck. i'm sure you'll have it up and running low 12's in no time.
-
Sorry to hear about the tranny, but buck up man! Theres lots of racing left :rockon:
-
48 passes and alot of smiles your the man to put another together in no time :) Good to see you run on the weekend and talk abit will see you at the next shindig
Later outkast
-
Yo Geoff..\"The pass that beat Geoff\" line..news to me..apples and oranges..I'm surprised the trans lasted that long launching my tank..
-
Yo Geoff.."The pass that beat Geoff" line..news to me..apples and oranges..I'm surprised the trans lasted that long launching my tank..
Okay all you owners of high performance VW's. Read this.
It's not a question of \"if\" your transmission is going to fail, it's a matter of \"when\". Lanny's car regularly runs 1.58 to 1.60 sec sixty foot times (Is this correct Lanny?). Anybody who runs the same sixty foot times can expect limited trans life also. Lifespan is inversely proportional to weight of the car, horsepower, and traction. Something to think about, for all you guys who want to hotrod your motors.
Geoff, thanks for posting the pics!
-
So that was a 4.12 r&p ? and was it the r&p that broke or was it the pin thing as Tom H suggested ? Either way it seems that it could have been a lot worse had the trany actualy locked up at speed on the hwy. Has this ever happened to anyone?
ps , sorry to hear this Lanny
-
Something to think about, for all you guys who want to hotrod your motors.
and yet, friday night at mission, a certain someone (see above) and another certain someone *cough*gavin*cough* were trying to talk me out of building my 1776 mouse motor and going for a stroked 2275? ;) :lol:
-
No Doubt! EVERY time you get \"on it\" it's like rolling the dice! Weight IS the enemy and sooner or later every R&P let's you down. Sorry to hear of your misfortune Lanny! been there, done that, DIDN\"T LIKE IT EITHER! Wayne
-
That sucks Lanny. Well looks like the shifter is the least of your worries now. Hope you get it back in action before the end of the season.
Hmmm... my 5 speed looks all nice a purdy sitting in my shop in one piece...do I really wanna install it and roll the dice? :D... Hells yeah!
-
Trevor..It's looks like we are doing a show(Winston) in Sakatoon around the 22nd of Sept, I'll keep you posted. You think I'm giving up on the Berg 5?..Hell no!
-
Okay all you owners of high performance VW's. Read this.
It's not a question of "if" your transmission is going to fail, it's a matter of "when". Lanny's car regularly runs 1.58 to 1.60 sec sixty foot times (Is this correct Lanny?). Anybody who runs the same sixty foot times can expect limited trans life also. Lifespan is inversely proportional to weight of the car, horsepower, and traction. Something to think about, for all you guys who want to hotrod your motors.
Adding to this, I've heard that the guys in Calif who are deep into the 12s with their heavy street cars view an aftermarket cast iron superdiff as a consumable, to be replaced annually.
The bores for the pins pound out, allowing the pins to wiggle around, suspended only by the roll pin. The roll pin quickly gets mangled then the pin falls out.
The market really needs an affordable steel superdiff, just like the one Weddle used to make about 10 years ago. Darren's lucky enough to be an owner of one of those gems.
-
The bores for the pins pound out, allowing the pins to wiggle around, suspended only by the roll pin. The roll pin quickly gets mangled then the pin falls out.
Good points Bruce. I've noticed that the newer super diffs that ERCO sells have the rolled pins running perpendicular to the axles. These pins should not shear off like the old super diffs, where the rolled pins are installed parallel to the axles. Hopefully, we won't see as many catastrophic failures. Diffs will still be consumable, but spider shafts won't be falling out, messing things up.
-
Hmm, the last time I put the Ercos on, there seemed to be more slack in the diff than usual. As it was working fine, I didn't think any more of it. I'll find out this evening how bad it really is.
-
Hope there's more to salvage than there is to throw away!!
Mike
-
It's looks like we are doing a show(Winston) in Sakatoon around the 22nd of Sept,
you guys playing at the wash-n-slosh, lanny?
trevor probably knows what that is. laundry mat/bar in saskatoon. despite what peoples first impression may be, when the band i was in played there, we had a great time. the bartender/manager was a guy named terry. he set us up really good w/ a sweet place to stay, plenty of grub and massive amounts of beer. and we got to do our laundry aswell.
good times on the road. :rockon:
-
Tough luck with the Berg 5 dude...
At least you've got the parts to fix it.
Thanks for all the linkage advice. I'm going to the track tonight, to see if I can better my times from your show. As a point of interest, I found an oil slick under my car yesterday evening...seem that all those times I thought the suspension was bottoming out, it was my drain plug....needless to say, it was shaved perfectly flat (probably happened on the tow home to Calgary) and was barely finger tight. I guess it was knocked loose. I'm just glad I caught it.
-
Hey Lanny if you need your case washed after disassemble let me know, got a huge industrial parts washer at work...
-
It looks like the stock 71-72 case will be the one..anybody have one for sale? Dual side cover with the late T/O bearing. The parts washer sounds great James, thanks. BTW, the spider pin slid out(broken roll pin) causing the pin to make friends with the R/P, causing the case to explode.. So far, the Berg stuff appears fine(sigh..) It will need a diff, case and the R/P. Not too bad. Cheers.
-
How are the diff gears?
-
Hi Bruce..I haven't pulled the diff apart yet. Are you interested in putting the beast together? Do you have a 71-72 case for sale? Gimme a call 604-202-7810
-
Yes that is a pretty wimpy looking roll pin in there. I think I'll investigate and see if I can tap mine for a long set screw. Like a 3/4\" long 8/32 or something along those lines. Tim
-
Yes that is a pretty wimpy looking roll pin in there. I think I'll investigate and see if I can tap mine for a long set screw. Like a 3/4" long 8/32 or something along those lines. Tim
Is the pin running parallel or perpendicular to the axles?
-
It's a diff that's in my car right now but I'm pretty sure it runs parallel. I just went and looked a stock diff. Pin Runs perpendicular and with a very large pin. Once again the forefathers already had it figured out.. Tim
-
If you don't find a case i probably have something, you're talking 71-2 irs with sleeve for throwout brg.? Marcel
-
I talked to Lanny Sat afternoon and if anyone has a 71-]early 73 DSC IRS case, he'd like to buy it. He has no leads yet. If you have a 71 or newer swing axle case, that will be the same. He's considering complete cores too.
Note: all 71 and later cases have the guided TO bearing. We'll even consider a '70 case. Those have the bosses for the studs that hold the TO bearing guide, so they can be converted easily.
-
Question about the 71-] cases, what is the special significance/difference about them? Are they stronger or something? Bruce......help.......
Mike
-
Nothing special about them. In fact they are the second most inferior IRS case to use in an IRS application.
With VW transmissions there is a simple progression. The newer it is, the better. Since high volume swing axle trans sales ended in 68, using a 71 case gets you a few of the improvements of the later years.
It gets you the larger pinion bearing that started in 69 (or 70?).
Then it gets you the superior guided throw out bearing that started in 71. If you've ever heard of the TO bearing clips falling off, that problem is isolated to early TO bearings only. The later ones can't fall off since they are integral to the TO bearing.
-
Thanks Bruce, in terms of strengthening a tranny for street and strip abuse, what are the most important modifications that need to be done? I mean I know that you install a superdiff, to gain the two extra spider gears, but what else would you need?
Mike
-
With VW transmissions there is a simple progression. The newer it is, the better.
Depends on the year of the trans. If you have a 61-63 trans, you throw the whole thing in the garbage. If you have a 73 or later, you do almost nothing.
-
Except in a later trans it's better to replace the fine toothed 3/4 with earlier model ones if you're planning on a higher HP output than stock motor. Tim
-
I've got a swing axle tranny in the garage right now. is there an easy way to find out what it is?
-
The first thing to do is look at the numbers stamped on the lower right side ahead of the diff. Once you find the part number of the case, look down 1 1/2\", there's the trans #.
Then you can go by some features. Does it have long axles? Provision for a backup light switch? Much more than that requires a teardown.
-
(https://airspeedparts.com/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fscratchy.kicks-ass.net%2Fpix%2Fcam%2FDifferential2.jpg&hash=68612f360fd1ed02e7ca2e599eff17004b12c218)
Bumpity bump bump...
Here's a picture of some super diffs. The left one is my old one (TIPH brand), where the spider shaft fell out (like Lanny's). The diff on the right is the new one from ERCO. Notice the orientation of the spiral lock pins. The old diff used 1/8\" spiral pins, the new diff uses 1/4\" spiral pins. You can see the mangled spider shaft hole on top of the old diff, I had to file off the rounded off edges, in order to get the ring gear off.
Sorry! I left this as a large photo, so you you can get more detail.
-
Thanks for the update Cam . Is there some advantage to this new orientation or is it just a way of identifing the good diffs ? And which comes first , the pounded shaft bore or the broken and/or lost lock pin ?
-
The bores for the pins pound out, allowing the pins to wiggle around, suspended only by the roll pin.
-
Thanks Cam!