4 Speed Or 5 Speed?

[DDS]

I'm getting ready to start an air cooled project and i'm not sure what the pros and cons are with different tranys.

i want a really solid trany good for 250 hp (ha ha it will take a while to get there)
thoughts were as follows

option 1 - bus trany?
option 2 - 911? price depending
option 3 - you tell me (i'm not sure of the cost of a built tI trany or a berg 5 and what type of hp you can put to them on a regular bases)

any positive info would really help steer me in the right direction.

Thanks!  

[Custom76Bus]

curious about this too... not sure if my tranny will handle the powa

[Bruce]

You first have to decide what you are going to do with it.  Are you gonna put slicks on the car and go drag racing 10 times each year?  Or will it only see street tires?

[DDS]

it won't be a daily driver (need a truck for work) but i want to cruz 6 months out of the year and with any luck (time away from the kids or with ??) set it up for a bit of racing both slalom and drag.

something i can drive to whistler and back for fun.

i would love to be able to race it X times a year. the main thing is i want a tuff tranny.

i'll just keep dreamming now.

[Hansk]

Berg 5 ....I believe your looking at about $2500us in parts alone(someone correct me if I'm wrong) but could be the best of all worlds. ....strong , fits your car(sort of) , close ratios and good hwy gearing.

Bus...strong but very low gearing, not so easy to fit.

Porsche...probably good gearing , cheaper than berg 5 , and even harder to fit than bus ( I think).

Stock ......cheapest , totally fits your car, many upgrades available, but always a compromise in ratio's one way or the other.

just my own sort of a rough over view of the options

[Darren Dilley]

Berg 5 is a small forturn....... and it didnt come with axles   that sucks  

[DDS]

Thank's for the feed back!

what kinda hp can the berg5 take?

i also heard something about the main shaft being quite long which led to flexing?

is that true?  

[Lanny]

I have at least 100 passes on my Berg 5. The first time it broke, the pinion shaft eneded up in 2 pieces. Berg stated that it was a fluke and it was the first time they had ever seen that part break. My luck.The engine was making around 175 HP at that point. The second time, it basically exploded. The Super diff was to blame, nothing to do with the Berg kit. If you compare the amount of passes to many other people running a T1 box, it appears to be about average in the failure dept. . I still love it will be used in the new build.
 

[Trevor P]

The extended mainshafts that Berg uses are a weak point if you have lots of power. If you achieve 250hp then I would opt for the one piece mainshaft that is available. I believe its an extra $500 to $800 (approx.)

[Bruce]

i want a really solid trany good for 250 hp (ha ha it will take a while to get there)


i also heard something about the main shaft being quite long which led to flexing?

Is this turbo or nitrous?

A Berg 5 is no weaker or stronger than a stock 4 speed.  All the upgrades you can do to the stock 4 will work to improve the strength of a Berg 5.  
The length of a Berg mainshaft between the bearing supports is exactly the same as a stock 4 speed, so flexing would be identical.  The extra length of a B5 hangs out in the nosecone and has 5th gear on it.

Like Lanny said, it will have the same life as a 4 speed.  The big difference is that if it does break, it costs waaaaaaaaay more to fix.

[DDS]

well i was hoping to go with a t4 motor and a turbo setup, (turbo will be down the road). i do have a 914 tranny in my shed (not sure of its condition). from what i have been reading up on the 914 tranny isn't too bad to change over for a rear engine car. one point that was made was that the week point is 1st gear because its between a bushing in the nose cone and a shaft bearing. (correct me if i'm wrong)

can anyone tell me if the 914/901 trannys are very strong? would i be spending less money setting up a 914/901 or a berg 5?

do you have to modify the pan for a b5?

by the way Lanny 100 passes on the b5 is pretty impressive (strenght wise).
what was your average time in the 1/4 mile?

Thanks for all of the helpfull info guys!

[jim martin]

all i will add is PAY ONCE AND CRY ONCE .
once you drive a car with a close gear stack and a stock 4th for cruising you will understand why the berg 5 is worth every cent.
i see you want to know how much?
3 years ago from rancho i payed $3500.00 us funds for my trans
including 5 speed mid mount,locking shifter , saw axles and tubes.
everthing came for a complete bolt in right down to the oil.
talk to air speed as they are a rancho trans dealer

[Bruce]

do you have to modify the pan for a b5?

 

It depends on the year of the car.  Early ones need a bit more work than late cars.   Sometimes you have to dimple the body.
On my 75, I found the hole in the pan for the shift rod needed to be extended down at least a

[DDS]

Thanks Bruce.

great time saving info.

[Lanny]

Bruce, the suggestion to 'hit the torsion housing' was actually meant be 'smash the body' with a sledge hammer, as in the Berg instructions. DDS, My car averaged 13.5-14.0 1/4's for about 30-40 passes, the rest have been between 12.4's and 13.1's . It is set up with rubber mounts and I run M&H slicks at the track. The car weighs around 1830 at the track w. driver. As Jim and Bruce stated, they are worth every penny. The people that knock a Berg 5 usually are too cheap to fork out the $$  

[Bruce]

Bruce, the suggestion to 'hit the torsion housing' was actually meant be 'smash the body' with a sledge hammer, as in the Berg instructions.

I wasn't following the Berg recommendations on clearancing.  Glenn in NY has a 74, built about 6 months before my car, and he said he only had to give it a few taps on the torsion housing.  I figured maybe something changed in the torsion housing to eliminate the need for major clearancing.  I found out later that his nosecone was touching his torsion housing.